**Session Date/Time:** 08 Nov 2023 08:30

# genarea

## Summary
The genarea meeting covered three main topics: revision of IETF venue requirements, antitrust documents, and community control of ISG discuss guidelines. Discussions involved community feedback, proposed solutions, and potential next steps for each topic.

## Key Discussion Points

*   **IETF Venue Requirements Revision:**
    *   Clarification needed on "close proximity" for venue selection (e.g., defining maximum walking distance).
    *   Requirement for room block size should be more flexible than the current "one-third of attendees" rule. "Sufficient rooms to meet expected demand" proposed.
    *   Overflow hotels should be an optional feature.
    *   Ad-hoc space should be easily accessible for informal discussions, rather than strictly defined as a "lounge."
    *   Unfiltered Internet access: How to handle countries with filtering policies (e.g., New Zealand's child sexual abuse imagery filtering). The goal is transparency regarding such policies when choosing meeting locations.

*   **Antitrust Documents:**
    *   Concerns that guidance on "topics to avoid" or "topics requiring caution" could be weaponized to stifle legitimate discussion.
    *   Distinction between public and unpublished market data: Discussions about public market data are appropriate, but private market data present antitrust risks.
    *   The legal and competitive context of guidelines and policies was emphasized. The application is dependent on jurisdictional and situational nuance.
    *   Definition of group negotiations of IPR terms needs to clarify applicability within the IETF context (e.g. design teams).
    *   The role of the IETF in preventing threats or abusive conduct was discussed, and a need to ensure the standard process is kept transparent.

*   **Community Control of ISG Discuss Guidelines:**
    *   Discuss criteria are treated as authoritative but lack community consensus.
    *   The ISG balloting procedures and discuss criteria are internal processes not necessarily controlled by the community.
    *   Debate over whether current Discuss criteria adhere to RFC 2026, and if they can be formally appealed if not.
    *   Multiple options were discussed: status quo, documentation of internal ISG procedures, or moving control of the process to the community.
    *   A significant problem was identified: The community misunderstands the appeal process, sees Discuss/Abstain positions as permanent blocks even when intended otherwise, and isn't sufficiently aware of the underlying balloting criteria.
    *   The interplay between ADs, workgroup chairs, and process was identified as contributing to confusion, with the need to ensure greater understanding about roles and shared community values.

## Decisions and Action Items

*   **IETF Venue Requirements Revision:**
    *   Update the document to include a specific maximum walking distance/kilometer for "close proximity."
    *   New text will be provided that specifically addresses the need for IETF consensus for expiring meetings.
    *   Continue discussion on the meeting venue mailing list.

*   **Antitrust Documents:**
    *   Revise the document to replace "detailed market data" with "unpublished market data."
    *   Clarify that the document doesn't prevent discussion of implementation complexity.
    *   Include the clarification on "private or potentially discriminatory group negotiations of IPR terms," making the context is internal to the IETF.
    *   Discuss concerns over whether a new interpretation of 'private' that relates only to internal IETF groups is suitable.
    *   Continue the discussion on the antitrust policy mailing list. If agreement is not reached, a virtual interim genarea session will be considered.

*   **Community Control of ISG Discuss Guidelines:**
    *   The ISG will continue planning, documenting, and demystifying their balloting procedures.
    *   Continue discussion on the gendipsatch mailing list.
    *   Actionable proposals for modifying or clarifying discuss criteria or appeal processes are encouraged.

## Next Steps

*   Revised drafts of the IETF Venue Requirements and Antitrust Documents will be published and discussed on their respective mailing lists.
*   Mark Cunningham will refine and propose further steps on ISG discuss guideline community control, and solicit feedback on the gendipsatch mailing list.